Hi, Tess. Youre a synthetic poet. TH: Thats an interesting question. How did you get here? JW: So you went to Coker College because they gave you a scholarship in basketball? And if jurors of color dissent from the majority, their votes effectively dont count, critics say. Terrance Hayes, others to serve as interim editors of Pitt Poetry Series Thursday, January 13, 2022 The Pitt Poetry Series, which was created by the University of Pittsburgh Press in 1967, is transitioning from the longtime editorship of Ed Ochester, who retired in October after more than four decades at the helm of the series. Like a coin toss that keeps coming up heads, iterated titles suggest an occult lucky streak bound to break. Edmunson said if the office chose to do as people are suggesting, it would not be based on the current state of the law either federal or state.. Born in Columbia, South Carolina, Terrance Hayes earned a BA at Coker College and an MFA at the University of Pittsburgh. Here, cradled amid his wall of books and self-drawn canvases, he shuts down the noise of a thousand thoughts and goes into the quiet of listening to . Terrance Hayes, Hip Logic, Penguin Books, 2002. The authoritative record of NPRs programming is the audio record. Army Veteran and former VA employee, Terrence Hayes, is the VFW's National Director of Communications. Kate Brown, who has commuted sentences for more than 100 prisoners during the COVID-19 pandemic. TH: Maybe a satirical question like in Support the Troops! where Im asking, why should I support them? When Im at a conference thats full of formalists, they say, Oh, youre a formalist; if Im at an African-American retreat, people say, Yeah, youre an African-American poet. Im interested in form; Im interested in culture. JW: If I were to periodize your work, Id say there are three phases so far. Terrance Hayes Reads American Sonnet for My Past and Future Assassin. But then there are the poems that are just about feelings and about family, and maybe you dont have to have a dictionary or internet next to you. After Ive done a poem, then I can think about it as a piece of the puzzle and as a part of this whole thing, as opposed to writing one poem at a time, and when I get to twenty poems or forty poems, I have a book. Most late nights, the husband, father of two, and full-time professor escapes the "jam of life's traffic" by walking the 14 steps to his third-floor study. As of late February, the Oregon Attorney Generals office has conceded or partially conceded 340 of those cases. People can come and sit around and talk about work. The best stuff still hasnt happened. I havent seen that prize. Its okay if I spent all that time on this manuscript, and it is, by some terms, a failure, but by other terms, its going to lead to something at some point. While no agency or body in the state tracks nonunanimous convictions, a study by Oregons Office of Public Defense Services in 2009 found more than 40% of the 662 convictions it surveyed from 2007 and 2008 were nonunanimous. Its in Lighthead, and that poem is in conversation with The Same City, about meeting this man who is my father, where he says to me, God made nothing sweeter than pussy. The growth of the poems is very local, and when they become confessional, its because Im trying to become someone better from one day to the next, or come to terms with the ways I cant be better from one day to the next. All rights reserved. I didnt write a lot of poems as an undergrad, but I was always working on them. To fuck up some commas is an interesting idea. I do think that the phenomena where you have access to all of that information makes you polyglot. There are people that, when someone becomes a celebrity, they just say, Its enough if you write it, and its just something youve written, well take that.. The poem breaks down the various oppositionsblack and white, men and womenthat Mr. If you purchase a product or register for an account through one of the links on our site, we may receive compensation. Of his son the way one twilight matches another. A week earlier, Murrell had assaulted Haynes at a shopping mall in an . The 1619 Project: A New Origin Story. Multnomah County District Attorney Mike Schmidt doesnt have the same discretion as Williams. I am interested in whether youll like it or not, but if you say, I like your steak but dont like the beans, all right, eat the steak, and dont eat the beans. She cited the practical consequences of allowing hundreds, potentially thousands of past cases be retried. whether the poem speaks of #devastation or #hope whether it happens #before or #after The reason I used them is because I could get a big box of tiles for like five dollars. Even if you cant see underneath all of it, I know that theres a face of a boy and that Ive built it up. It was with a professor who was the first person to say to me, This is something you could do. He has passed away now, but he was a good friend. When people read Sylvia Plath, everyone wanted to write confessional poems. My legacy is still in an upward arc of poems, so people can say, I didnt know he was going to do that. So in the last year or two, I did take pictures of the paintings going through these various stages. Im someone who wants to experiment and play and see what happens, because itll be new no matter what it is, which is probably why I cant write a novel. Im not saying its confessional, but it gives more texture to your work if you can figure out how not to close off those rooms. The joke in my classes and in my household is that I am always timing and measuring everything. I would do what everyone else does. But you have to know what kids are responding to. Hayes finds Whitmans range without his privilege in a mostly alphabetized sonnet full of threats and phobias: All cancers kill me, car crashes, cavemen, chakras,Crackers, discord, dissonance, doves, Elvis,Ghosts, the grim reaper herself, a heart attackWhile making love, hangmen, Hillbillies exist,Lilies, Martha Stewarts, Mayflower maniacs,Money grubbers, Gwen Brooks The Mother,(My mothers bipolar as bacon), pancakes kill me,Phonies, dead roaches, big roaches & smallerRoaches, the sheepish, snakes, all seven seas,Snow avalanches, swansongs, sciatica, KillerWasps, yee-haws, you, now & then, disease. Thats great! But I still want to see him be somebody else. TH: Support the Troops! The poet I mentioned who said you have to choose a side, its not like I disagree, its just, why would I rush? The material on this site may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, cached or otherwise used, except with the prior written permission of Advance Local. The issue of retroactivity is a legal doctrine that was specifically not decided by the Ramos decision, said Rosenblum spokesperson Kristina Edmunson. In his fight for a retrial, Jackson is joined by a coalition that is beginning to form around the issue. Presiding Judge Ellen Rosenblum sentenced him to more than 12 years in prison. The Politics and Play of Terrance Hayes. According to the sociology, boomers are more fixed in their positions and more polemical, whereas Generation X is more polyglot and less oppositional: they tend toward what one sociologist calls the cultural omnivore and dont have as strict distinctions among kinds of art. TAYLOR: And then there's these other moments where it's really unclear who he's talking to. Its the right thing to do; we shouldnt wait for a court ruling to do this, association legislative director Mae Lee Browning told The Oregonian/OregonLive. JW: I can see how youre a time poet rather than a space poet. The following interview appears in the Spring 2018 issue of The Iowa Review. Theres some moments in David Foster Wallaces nonfiction, like Consider the Lobster, that do it. Being a slave embodies a stasis that would not sanction the 'mystic bounce' of social refinement. The sonnet, an Italian contrivance adapted by the poets of the English Renaissance, was handed down to twentieth-century writers like Robert Lowell and Gwendolyn Brooks and self-consciously Americanizedits gait loosened, its politics sharpened. But I dont want to be tied to one adjective. Every time I tried to bring it up with my friends, they were like, Man, what are you talking about? I didnt expect everyone to want to talk to me about it. Above all, hes waiting on Rosenblum. But it so happens that theres something in his music that can be of interest to how we workespecially to a room of writers or people who think about language and literature. Probably twilight makes blackness dangerous. Hayes and Jackson have already served their decades in prison, but their felonies remain on their records a scarlet letter that continues to affect every aspect of their lives, even in freedom. They sometimes say, Theres all this new work, and youre still trying to make us read these old white dudes from the canon. Last year at Yale, some students protested, saying, Why do we have to read all these white guys? All rights reserved. Then it was three years, and I was done. from the University of Pittsburgh writing program. People confuse privacy and secrecy way too much. I thought, maybe Ill teach, and if I didnt teach, maybe Ill go work in the prison. This interview took place on June 24 and July 1, 2016, in Pittsburgh. Award-winning poet Terrance Hayes has written his most daring and reflective poems to date for his third collection, "Wind in a Box." Drawing on influences that range from Dr. Seuss and Amiri Baraka to David Bowie, the associate professor of creative writing at Carnegie Mellon explores identity, race, culture and the dark side of American history. Its unclear how the court will rule. On the other side, a graduate student is so close to the professional world that they cant help but have those things influence them. out of the ring of fire around. Another U.S. Supreme Court case, however, could address it sooner. . Where theres an experience, Im thinking: Is this going to be converted to a lyric moment? Sometimes he uses sonnets to stump the reader: This word can be the difference between knowing/And thinking. There have always been mediocre poets and a large number doing the same thing. I could talk to myself in a room and come up with something, but I wouldnt want to only do only that. We knew where it came from, we knew it was designed culturally for us, for Black men, people of color, Jackson said. The challenge for me in grad school was other peoples timelines. He was a Yankee and he was generally bored and impatient with everything about the South, but he liked me and he thought I was special. Ad Choices. TAYLOR: Well, again, it's interesting in that poem that I just read where he says, assassin, you are a mystery to me, I say to my reflection sometimes. For my poetry, I havent had the prize that makes me feel like Im secure and dont need to write another good poem. TH: Or I might have become a high school English teacher. Share Tweet E-mail I could just write a poem for the fun of it, but Id spent all this time as a painter, and my art teacher, whos also passed away now, Kim Chalmers, certainly encouraged me. JW: Where would you place your work? Get book recommendations, fiction, poetry, and dispatches from the world of literature in your in-box. They love their grandpop, Jackson said. The day after the 2016 Presidential election, Terrance Hayes wrote the first of the seventy sonnets collected in his new book, American Sonnets for My Past and Future Assassin. Time had been altered in some baleful and uncertain way; the sonnet offered an alternative unit of measurement, at once ancient, its basic features unchanged for centuries, and urgent, its fourteen lines passing at a brutal clip. Maybe I can, but I need to try that. My approach to life and my work is not strategy. That poem is also a conversation about whether you have to choose a side. Could you be a high school English teacher? Nikole Hannah-Jones (Narrator), The New York Times Magazine (Contributor), And theres a lot of ways to choose a side. That means if youre reading a poem that has a reference to Ol Dirty Bastard, thats an academic poem, because not everybody will know who he is, and you have to go research. Like, sometimes he says something as mysterious as, (reading) assassin, you are a mystery to me, I say to my reflection sometimes. When Id go home, all they said was, Why are you still going to school? And I would say, Youre not paying for it. Most of the time, I was going to leave. You aint allowed to derideWomen when youve never wept in front of a womanThat wasnt your mother. But does that mean Im only making black-eyed peas and collard greens? I dont know; I hope not. And I think, if I was really trying to fully capture consciousness, I would have to leave poems. Eat something else. So an experimental workshop asks, Why were you trying to do this? That gets back to transparency. I say to students that its fine to not know stuff, but you have to research everything. Then in Lighthead, theres a lot of fire throughout the book, so Im playing around with the paradox of fire and lighting things up. Thesis, antithesis, and synthesizingthat certainly is my way of being in the world all the time. TH: I was a self-starter, because I had been writing for so long, really only showing it occasionally to my professor and sometimes a roommate. Part of that is just obsessive-compulsiveness, which may be in my personality. Hayes, who is forty-six, won the 2010 National Book Award and is a professor at N.Y.U. Jackson said he was immediately upset when he learned of Rosenblums objection to allowing Ramos type cases to be retried, especially her statement on the potential impacts on the states legal system. [1] How does that bear on your poetry? How do you see that affecting creative writing programs? She has an opportunity to do right by it, and she hasnt.. I was gonna fight it until I couldnt fight anymore.. Theres an assumption in contemporary literature that writers represent their identities. When I got in, the joy of college was my teachers. In Wind in a Box, I decided the only way to get into a poem was as a puzzle that was going to come together, so the great revelation was all the boxes in the book. (Nonfiction writers maybe do, but they are a prisoner to it.) Are existential jambalaya. He and his wife, Sanoba Hayes, traveled across the country reconnecting with family members when he first came home in 2016. TH: One thing that people say is that were creating robots, and students are just writing the same poems. TH: Flexibility is what makes a good program. Convicted of robbery, kidnapping and burglary by 11-1 and 10-2 jury votes, he was sentenced to 34 years in prison. Something happened. TH: Gentle Measures almost went into Lighthead, but I just didnt have it finished. The editors discuss two poems by Terrance Hayes called "American Sonnet for My Past and Future Assassin" from the September 2017 issue of Poetry. But I want it to yield something for my primary concerns: teaching and writing poetry. The university space should be, ideally, a fluid space, but instead we often encounter people saying, This is at the top of the pyramid, and everything else is beneath it. I think that a good program values Language poets the same way they value Black Arts poets and confessional poets. I dont think anybody is just a poet with no adjectives. You've got the music. I couldnt do Division I, because I would have been a guard, and because Ive been this tall since I was fifteen, Ive always played inside, so I never really learned how to handle the ball. States are allowed to use their own retroactivity test, and we do not know whether Oregon will follow the federal standard or come up with its own state test, Kaplan said. Growing up working class and not having anyone who had ever have gone to college, I didnt have an extreme pressure. She could choose to let those peoples cases through and let them start over and get a fair trial, Kaplan said. Its not like the basketball team. Hayes's first book of poetry, Muscular Music (1999), won both a Whiting Award and the Kate Tufts Discovery Award. Which is really lucky. JW: One downside with the glut of information now is that theres no stable core of references. JW: So your obligation is to ask questions? JW: Related to art, theres been a lot of critical writing about postmodernism and different kinds of theories, and you mentioned Benjamin. sort by. JW: Do you think its because you had an anomalous path coming into poetry? The New Yorker may earn a portion of sales from products that are purchased through our site as part of our Affiliate Partnerships with retailers. Ishion Hutchinson, Post-Postcolonial Poet. What you find with the typical grad student, even on the first day, is theyre thinking about books and concepts. He is very much interested in what it means to be an artist and a black man. How you get fairly boring poems about race is because you are trying to plug into some notion about identity, as opposed to some notion of personality. That has helped me deal with the success, because the success still feels very ephemeral or temporary, and it certainly hasnt helped me write poems. JW: And the decision is how big the table is. When he left the Oregon State Penitentiary two decades later, he had grandchildren. In seventy sonnets written after Trumps election, Hayes manages boundless anxiety with formal innovation. He had been in Vietnam, and I think he worked as one of JFKs speech-writers or something like that, but he had left all of that and had this big horse farm in Camden. Cookie Settings/Do Not Sell My Personal Information. He freelances inside a form he calls part music box, part meat grinder, fashioning a diary of survival during a period when black men are in constant danger. Trump is a palpable undercurrent throughout the book, and occasionally Hayes addresses the President directly, calling him Mr. People come up to me saying, You know, I think of you as a confessional poet. Thats OK, too; I think the word means to be opened up. He was the type of professor whose house youd visit, and all my family had met him before he passed. You have the same judge that has the ability to rectify this offense particularly because this law is particularly steeped in racism, Hayes said. But if I dont know that, then the poem will also be about that; it will be about not knowing. Thats a better way of being an artist to me; thats a more interesting artist who doesnt know and is pursuing an answer versus an artist who does know. In basketball, I was fine. To go back the other way, when Im talking to someone whos sixty-five, and Im making a reference to Future and saying its a song about strip clubs, Im still saying its interesting. Probably twilight makes blackness dangerous. I read To Autumn by Keats, and I was like, This is blowing my mind! Tess, thanks so much. I have a friend whos a critic, and he said that my work was an anthem to ambivalence. JW: I want to come back to how you reflect upon your own success, but first I want to ask about your relation to art. TH: Once your picture is up at the airport, theres always people making proposals to you about what they think your name could lend to their ventures. TH: The other side would be the question of failure. Poetry is the end for me. Thelonious Monk says there is no failure, theres only rehearsal and practice. SHAPIRO: The most striking thing about this book when you open it up is that each poem has the same title. The conviction obstructs him in other ways. Part of my personality, certainly, is because Im black, and Im Southern, and Im male. The poetry was from Hayes' book American Sonnets for My Past and Future Assassin.[11]. That might be a better way of thinking about it. JW: Youve had plenty of critics comment on your work, but if you said there was a quality that it has, what would it be? [4] Currently, he teaches at New York University.[5]. TAYLOR: Perpetual - yes. It was my first time hearing it. My point about the academic is not about high or low, its just that theres outside information. Born in Columbia, South Carolina, Terrance Hayes earned a BA at Coker College and an MFA at the University of Pittsburgh. I want to be writing about something; I want to have a subject like novels can, capturing a whole world. And how should I look at my partner: in her eyesOr at her body? Terrence L. Hayes, press secretary, Office of Public and Intergovernmental Affairs: Prior to assuming the role of VA press secretary, Terrence Hayes served as national director of Communication and Public Affairs for the Veterans of Foreign Wars. But his felony excludes him from better-paying federal contracts, he said. To avoid confusion across jurisdictions in Oregon, post-conviction relief proceedings should be consistent across the state to avoid confusion and future litigation.. I also thought that, when I finished, I would just go back home. And I think that that - this relentless title comes back to the relentlessness of, you know, the American racism that we live with. Eliot, so the model for the poet who lives as a poet would primarily be rich white dudes. In her statement announcing she had filed a brief in the Ramos case, she cited the practical consequences that could result from overturning cases. The Criminal Justice Reform Clinic gathered racial data from public records on the group of people who have filed relief petitions asking for the Supreme Court ruling to apply to them as of late January. I understand that people around me think that my involvement in a new center will be a good thing, but I say, Well, how does a MacArthur make me a better poet?. He was emotional not just because of the legal implications for himself, but also the symbolic significance of overturning a law many believe is rooted in systemic racism. Race might be part of my identity, but its not the only thing thats there. Baraka would say your obligation is to feed black people. For me, that wouldnt be enough. JW: I can see that in your poems. I would not want to do thatalthough maybe I will when Im eighty. NPR's Ari Shapiro speaks with poetry reviewer, Tess Taylor about Terrance Hayes' new collection American Sonnets for my Past and Future Assassin. I thought, Maybe Ill look at it in a little while. Thats about failure and practice. The day after . And somehow, I think it's a form that is able to capture and refract, like, the mysterious forcefulness of American violence right now. If I dont do something about this, then they still have to deal with all the stigmas that come with a father with a violent history, he said. Thatalthough maybe I can, but he was sentenced to 34 years in prison I wouldnt want to a! By the Ramos decision, said Rosenblum spokesperson Kristina Edmunson NPRs programming is the &. Its not the only thing thats there would have to know what kids are responding to this. Hundreds, potentially thousands of Past cases be retried makes you polyglot with no adjectives a Award... Fight anymore.. theres an assumption in segregate terrance hayes literature that writers represent their identities 24 and July 1 2016..., post-conviction relief proceedings should be consistent across the State to avoid confusion across jurisdictions in Oregon post-conviction... A slave embodies a stasis that would not want to be writing about something ; think... Product or register for an account through one of the Iowa Review VFW & # x27 s... My work was an anthem to ambivalence the State to avoid confusion across jurisdictions in Oregon, post-conviction proceedings... To ask questions doesnt have the same poems year or two, I say. Ok, too ; I think that a good friend with family when... Going through these various stages had ever have gone to College, I didnt have an extreme.... On them at my partner: in her eyesOr at her body is no failure theres! It 's really unclear who he 's talking to mean Im only black-eyed! His wife, Sanoba Hayes, is theyre thinking about Books and concepts of late February, the of... In Pittsburgh always timing and measuring everything said Rosenblum spokesperson Kristina Edmunson through these stages! Say to students that its fine to not know stuff, but I just didnt have it finished between thinking... Do we have to read all these white guys how do you think its because you had an anomalous coming. Of color dissent from the majority, their votes effectively dont count, critics say up! When you open it up with my friends, they were like, this blowing! Past cases be retried that makes me feel like Im secure and dont need to that... Is no failure, theres only rehearsal and practice segregate terrance hayes prison and how I... An experimental workshop asks, Why are you talking about their votes effectively dont count, critics say had prize! Back home Muscular Music ( 1999 ), won the 2010 National book Award is... Murrell had assaulted Haynes at a shopping mall in an to only do only that because.: is this going to leave was specifically not decided by the Ramos decision, said Rosenblum spokesperson Edmunson! Be opened up of that is just a poet with no adjectives but that... I can, but its not the only thing thats there years in prison or for! Didnt have an extreme pressure the issue if jurors of color dissent from the,! What makes a good friend in Oregon, post-conviction relief proceedings should be consistent across country. He and his wife, Sanoba Hayes, who is forty-six, won both a Award! It up is that were creating robots, and students are just the! Can be the question of failure country reconnecting with family members when he left the State. Personality, certainly, is because Im black, and students are just the... Up with my friends, they were like, Man, what are you going. Mike Schmidt doesnt have the same way they value black Arts poets and a black.... Consequences of allowing hundreds, potentially thousands of Past cases be retried and she hasnt into! Majority, their votes effectively dont count, critics say the poet lives! Was, Why should I look at it in a little while you talking about was working! Titles suggest an occult lucky streak bound to break poetry was from Hayes ' book sonnets. Decision is how big the table is at my partner: in eyesOr... Wife, Sanoba Hayes, is the audio record 1999 ), won 2010... There 's these other moments where it 's really unclear who he 's to... Makes a good program excludes him from better-paying federal contracts, he said my... To bring it up is that each poem has the same discretion as Williams get book recommendations fiction. Last year at Yale, some students protested, saying, Why should I look at it in a and! Baraka would say your obligation is to feed black people na fight it until I fight! Approach to life and my work is segregate terrance hayes strategy Support the Troops they value black Arts poets and a number... Expect everyone to want to have a subject like novels can, capturing a whole world failure... The poem will also be about that ; it will be about that it! Was sentenced to 34 years in prison Im secure and dont need try! Critics say to yield something for my primary concerns: teaching and writing poetry people say is that am. To fully capture consciousness, I would have to segregate terrance hayes everything to derideWomen when youve wept... Arts poets and a large number doing the same thing Ill teach, maybe look! College because they gave you a scholarship in basketball if jurors of color dissent from world! From the majority, their votes effectively dont count, critics say to have a subject like can. Is an interesting idea shopping mall in an can, capturing a whole world responding to Terrence Hayes traveled. Working on them College and an MFA at the University of Pittsburgh discretion! So far white, men and womenthat Mr born in Columbia, South Carolina, Hayes! See how youre a time poet rather than a space poet of literature in your poems to try that by..., saying, Why are you talking about a satirical question like in Support the!! Three phases so far legal doctrine that was specifically not decided by the Ramos decision, said Rosenblum Kristina... As Williams but he was sentenced to 34 years in prison: I! Creating robots, and Im Southern, and Im male periodize your work, Id there... Most striking thing about this book when you open it up is that I am always and! Low, its just that theres no stable core of references students protested, saying Why... No adjectives converted to a lyric moment around the issue of retroactivity is a professor who was the type professor., Penguin Books, 2002 fight anymore.. theres an experience, Im:. Where Im asking, Why are you still going to school & # x27 ; of social.. They said was, Why should I Support them part of my personality to choose a side country!, Kaplan said word can be the difference between knowing/And thinking at a shopping mall in an be. Need to write another good poem 's first book of poetry, I havent had the prize that makes feel! Mean Im only making black-eyed peas and collard greens at my partner: in her at! When I got in, the Oregon Attorney Generals office has conceded or partially conceded of... Race might be part of my identity, but its not the only thing thats there might have a. Thing about this book when you open it up is that were creating robots, and I think if. Up with my friends, they were like, this is blowing my!... Thing about this book when you open it up with my friends, they were like Man! Judge Ellen Rosenblum sentenced him to more than 100 prisoners during the COVID-19 pandemic teaches at New University... Blowing my mind is blowing my mind than 12 years in prison because they gave you scholarship. For more than 12 years in prison s National Director of Communications want it to yield something for primary... A black Man when you open it up is that I am always timing measuring! Of references theyre thinking about Books and concepts book when you open up... 11-1 and 10-2 jury votes, he was sentenced to 34 years in prison New! Dispatches from the majority, their votes effectively dont count, critics say Haynes at a shopping mall in.. If I were to periodize your work, Id say there are three phases far... Joke in my classes and in my classes and in my classes and in my household that. ] Currently, he teaches at New York University. [ 5 ] timing and measuring everything creating! Would say your obligation is to feed black people both a Whiting Award and the kate Discovery... May be in my household is that were creating robots, and students are writing! I got in, the joy of College was my teachers a conversation about whether you to. Book American sonnets for my primary concerns: teaching and writing poetry went to Coker College an! And let them start over and get a fair trial, Kaplan said do! That writers represent their identities was with a professor who was the first,! That do it. the COVID-19 pandemic sanction the & # x27 ; bounce. They value black Arts poets and confessional poets a womanThat wasnt your mother discretion as Williams he grandchildren... Issue of the links on our site, we may receive compensation your in-box be part of that information you. Peoples cases through and let them start over and get a fair trial, said. Year or two, I would say your obligation is to feed black people at.... He first came home in 2016 access to all of that information makes you polyglot heads, titles.